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Les Baer 9x23?

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Has anybody seen one of these? Owned one? Shot one? Especially intrested in the opinions of the smiths on the board who make these things for a living. I want to know if Les is doing them right. :wink: Specifically the Premier II.

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Biathlonman on 2001-04-20 15:20 ]</font>
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No doubt someone in their shop has the ability to build a 9x23 but as of last year or less one of my cutomers was told by Les that they hadn't made a 9x23, was a bad idea and attempted to sell him a Super.

Huge difference between building a reliable Super and a 9x23. Simple test question...ask them about ramped and unramped barrels. If you are told "must have" a ramped barrel go else where IMO.
Ramped barrels? The only pro is not blowing 38 Super loads pumped to major power factors. Works better in high cap guns than single stacks IMO. Cons? Across the board most working smiths will suggest they are less reliable in any caliber. More so in single stack guns.

I no longer will build with ramped barrls for just those reasons. Makes one think about 9x23 for hot loads and I get the benefit of the utmost in reliability from the design.
On 2001-04-21 18:21, John Lawson wrote:
The available cases for 9X23 are, indeed, very stout.
Good info.

The Starline Super Comp brass is a better way to go.
Bad info.
The problem is most don't understand the 9x23. John might, but we disagree here.

The 9x23 as loaded by Winchester is exactly as "ordered". If the gun is built right and using the correct brass (read Winchester) the guns are awesome. MickyMouse it and the pressures and it's VERY dangerious.

General agreement in the smithing industry is the ramped barrels are not as reliable as the orginal Colt system in a 1911. Add to that the mag stack of a 10 round 9x23 flush mag and you'll have more problems as John mentions. Use the correct brass and there is no need for a ramped barrel in 9x23 for any reason.

And THAT is why some gun manufacturers and pistolsmiths will not make up 9X23 pistols or share their load data, and why some loading manuals ignore the cartridge entirely

I worked with sales and R&D at Winchester on the 9x23. I am currently building a 9x23 gun for Lapua and discussing brass options for 9x23 with them. I share all my 9x23 reloading data at http://www.burnscustom.com and when I get time will add some new ones we have been using, including a 147 gr bullet at 1400fps.

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Dane Burns on 2001-04-21 19:45 ]</font>
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9x23 is a strange bird. Takes some to get them to run. I have talked with more than one nationally known smith that needed help with the caliber.

Another phone call this week from a customer (not my customer mind you) about a ramped 9x23 from another shop that went back to the smith because it was not reliable.

I am not the only guy who can make them run but the list is indeed very small when it comes to 5" or smaller carry guns and the guys who can actually build a relaible gun.

Ask the smith if he carries a single stack and shoots factory 9x23 ammo while doing so. If not find, another smith is my suggestion. Past that get and check his references for 9x23 guns he has built.

Key here is Winchester factory ammo.

That will limit the field quickly.

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Dane Burns on 2001-06-23 02:53 ]</font>
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