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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Hi, Guys
I am knew to this forum and have found it to be very informative. Can anyone tell me why SA uses a two piece barrel? The only advantage I can see is maybe cost.

Thanks in advance.
Long live the 1911
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
I am glad to hear of the apparent change to a one piece barrel by SA. When I had my Kimber customized by Clark their web site stated that they would test any SA barrel prior to an accuracy job and would replace it if found necessary. I have felt that SA had begun building good 1911's with the exception of the two piece barrel. Thanks for the info.

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I just got a new SA SS 1911A1. The barrel was one piece unless they have an incredible welder!!! I can't imagine why they would make a two piece. I'm sure two piece would increase costs. Can someone even explain how or why they would make a two piece design?
 

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PRICE. It's cheaper to make the rifled tube and press fit it to the cast rear portion. Making a one piece barrel is harder and more expensive. You USUALLY see two piece barrels only on cheaper guns. It's sometimes very hard to detect a two piece, when it's well made. Some of the late Walther P-38/P4's had two piece barrels that were virtually impossible to detect.
You can be sure they don't make two piece barrels because their better!!

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: dfariswheel on 2001-09-03 22:06 ]</font>
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
Just thought I would post a follow-up to my first post. I just recently found and aquired a early SA TRP Tactical. The price was a steal and I needed a base gun for a custom project. Imagine my surprise when after cleaning and oiling and centering the rear sight I went to the range. Off of sandbags at 25 yards the TRP went 1.2 inches. Either I'm lucky (NOT) or the old two piece barrel ain't bad. The TRP had not been shot much.

When I send it to a smith for a full job I guess I am going to have to rethink the match barrel and bushing.
 

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I've had a couple of two piece barrels that came with Springfield Loaded models.

I think that the barrels may get dinged for accuracy when thier accuracy is actually poor because the barrels are poorly fitted.

I just shot one last night that had very good accuracy for about 5 of 7 shots. By this I mean that 5 shots would group very tightly and a couple of shots would be flyers. Now I know how to call my shots and just to be sure I shot groups with a known accurate gun/same ammo/mag right afterwards and they were tight.

The couple of flyers were caused by poor barrel fitting. But the basic accuracy of the barrel appeared to be very good. Not as good as a match barrel, but pretty darned good. In my mind there's no reason why a well made two peice barrel can't be accurate. But ANY barrel poorly fitted will be inaccurate.
 

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On 2001-09-03 22:04, dfariswheel wrote:
PRICE. It's cheaper to make the rifled tube and press fit it to the cast rear portion. Making a one piece barrel is harder and more expensive.
Really! I can't see how adding several manufacturing processes, manpower to do them, and more raw material inventory to control reduces costs. Beats me! Below, I will attempt to describe what I mean. Please don't abuse my simplified processes because I know there are several ways to make a barrel and I'm not sure how SA does it, so I just simplified it so it could be any method.

Normal process is start with bar stock. Machine outside shape. Deep hole drill and rifle inside. Cut chamber. Your low cost process.

New low cost process?? Get two pieces of bar stock. Machine FR barrel piece. Rifle this piece. Machine RR part. Precision weld FR and RR pieces together with perfect heat control, fixture alignment, oh yea, and a welder that leaves no bead. Oops there must be a bead. So, machine and blend bead to hide from customer! Result, if slowly and perfectly done, the same quality as the one piece barrels, most of the time.

As a result, more processes adds more variables and therefore more rejected barrels. Rejected barrels or "should have been rejected" barrels sent out only mak warranty and scrap, both of which don't make MONEY!

You USUALLY see two piece barrels only on cheaper guns. It's sometimes very hard to detect a two piece, when it's well made. Some of the late Walther P-38/P4's had two piece barrels that were virtually impossible to detect.
You can be sure they don't make two piece barrels because their better!!
Who makes two piece barrels? I'll tell you who. SSK makes a two piece barrel. It is one of the finest barrels that I own. It is on my Contender and shoot under an inch easily in 375 JDJ at 100 yds. It is two piece because that is the easiest way to make it. The barrel blank is rifled from a custom maker and is about 1" diameter with no taper. JDJones then welds on a lug to the bottom to mount it in the gun. This is some of the finest welding that you will ever see, but you can still see it. Of course this custom smith knows the limits of his abilities and did not try to weld a chamber on to rifling, because it is, in a practical sense, IMPOSSIBLE to make an accurate barrel doing that.
 

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...OK...but what's the point? Does your SA shoot accurately? If yes, are you going to change it anyway? If no...well...?
There are plenty of aftermarket barrels available. Are any two piece? If so, which are and which aren't?
 

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The 2 piece was developed in WW2 by subcontractors who didn't have the equipment to produce one piece easily. That's the short and dirty over simplified answer. The outer sleeve (chamber end) is press fit & silver soldered to the rifled tube. There are at least 3 variations on this that I've seen. The most accurate 45 I've ever shot has a 2 piece SA barrel refit (welded lugs & hood)to lock up tight. Built on an Essex frame, Rem-Rand slide, a bunch of take off parts, with a match bushing.
 

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The 2 piece was developed in WW2 by subcontractors who didn't have the equipment to produce one piece easily. That's the short and dirty over simplified answer. The outer sleeve (chamber end) is press fit & silver soldered to the rifled tube. There are at least 3 variations on this that I've seen. The most accurate 45 I've ever shot has a 2 piece SA barrel refit (welded lugs & hood)to lock up tight. Built on an Essex frame, Rem-Rand slide, a bunch of take off parts, with a match bushing.
 

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I have a 2001 Springfield Mil-Spec with two-piece barrel..
The only accuracy job I did was to install Wilson's match bushing and group gripper.. Those two made an awesome improvement.. At 20 yards, my Mil-Spec now prints sub-1" 5-shot group.. Before the bushing and gripper, it was around 2-3".. So I think two-piece Springfield barrel is pretty good by itself..
I'm not sure of its durability but accurcywise, I don't see a problem.. I think it's more of lock-up than barrel itself that determines pistol's accuracy..

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Audix on 2001-09-22 13:16 ]</font>
 
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