Only rented the basic HK 45 a couple times and I kinda like it. Local dealer has the expert and tactical for sale w/ a $200 difference. There any big differences between them? I have the money to buy either of them, but that would jeopardize my current project plans :sad: Should I buy one of them?
Whats the diff between the Expert and Tactical?
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Bufford,
The Expert is an attempt by HK to build a "target grade" USP pistol. The standard USP line enjoys reasonable accuracy but suffers from a relatively poor (heavy) trigger pull.
The tactical and Expert lines all feature the HK adjustable sight set.
The Tactical could be described as a stage "two" USP it includes the standard springs but recieves the upgraded barrel with threading and NATO chamber specs.
It also recieves the "match trigger w/ overtravel stop.
The Expert is really a stage "three" pistol and in addition to the tactical it recieves a match grade chamber, add-on flared mag well, and reduced power trigger springs.
Some of the "early" Expert models featured reduced power recoil springs (for target loads).
Personally, I chose the USP .45 Tactical and I replaced the HK adjustable sights with MMC adjustable tritium sights, I used the Wolff reduced power 10lb hammer spring.
FYI: It should also be noted that the Expert comes with high cap mags that feature an add-on bumper plate, these mags are clear and although unmarked are post ban magazines.
HK USA removes the mags and refits them with 10rd mags, if you should find high cap mags for the USP .45 series and SOCOM they are in fact post ban imports and are not legal for civillian use as it is illegal to import high capacity feeding devices.
<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: David DiFabio on 2001-04-28 15:56 ]</font>
The Expert is an attempt by HK to build a "target grade" USP pistol. The standard USP line enjoys reasonable accuracy but suffers from a relatively poor (heavy) trigger pull.
The tactical and Expert lines all feature the HK adjustable sight set.
The Tactical could be described as a stage "two" USP it includes the standard springs but recieves the upgraded barrel with threading and NATO chamber specs.
It also recieves the "match trigger w/ overtravel stop.
The Expert is really a stage "three" pistol and in addition to the tactical it recieves a match grade chamber, add-on flared mag well, and reduced power trigger springs.
Some of the "early" Expert models featured reduced power recoil springs (for target loads).
Personally, I chose the USP .45 Tactical and I replaced the HK adjustable sights with MMC adjustable tritium sights, I used the Wolff reduced power 10lb hammer spring.
FYI: It should also be noted that the Expert comes with high cap mags that feature an add-on bumper plate, these mags are clear and although unmarked are post ban magazines.
HK USA removes the mags and refits them with 10rd mags, if you should find high cap mags for the USP .45 series and SOCOM they are in fact post ban imports and are not legal for civillian use as it is illegal to import high capacity feeding devices.
<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: David DiFabio on 2001-04-28 15:56 ]</font>
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Scooter,
HK USA "builds" the .45 Expert and Tactical pistol lowers here and they do not install the magazine wells. The Magazine stack extension (official term) is in fact available for the USP .45 full size line. When they add the 10 rd magazines, you can in fact special order the mag well from them or purchase a European import with post ban LE magazines. As you discovered if you like the added feature you will need to install the HK Expert magazine stack extension with replacment clamping sleeve, average cost is $55.00
The add on base plate is $11.00 retail and $9.00 average cost, the base plate is a special order item and in most cases it is easier to spend $43.50 for the extended 10 rd magazine.
For most users purchasing the match trigger pack for $100.00 and having a smith install it is a much better way to go.
I should also mention that the extended slide on the expert model is designed to provide weight and to eliminate the requirement for the thread protector.
The additional model of the USP match adds the barrel weight system and the fully adjustable trigger option.
For normal USP users who like the case system it is available for $55.00 average from BlackHawk or HK.
HK USA "builds" the .45 Expert and Tactical pistol lowers here and they do not install the magazine wells. The Magazine stack extension (official term) is in fact available for the USP .45 full size line. When they add the 10 rd magazines, you can in fact special order the mag well from them or purchase a European import with post ban LE magazines. As you discovered if you like the added feature you will need to install the HK Expert magazine stack extension with replacment clamping sleeve, average cost is $55.00
The add on base plate is $11.00 retail and $9.00 average cost, the base plate is a special order item and in most cases it is easier to spend $43.50 for the extended 10 rd magazine.
For most users purchasing the match trigger pack for $100.00 and having a smith install it is a much better way to go.
I should also mention that the extended slide on the expert model is designed to provide weight and to eliminate the requirement for the thread protector.
The additional model of the USP match adds the barrel weight system and the fully adjustable trigger option.
For normal USP users who like the case system it is available for $55.00 average from BlackHawk or HK.
Like the man said, the Expert comes with the extended magazine well -- termed "jet funnel" by HK --in the 9mm and .40 caliber versions. If added to the .45 frame, the gun is not legal in IPSC standard class.
As far as the 12-round .45 mags for the full-size USPs, they are available from reputable dealers in the US and do not have postban markings. Contrary to the bull you read on the boards and even from HK USA, these mags are presumed by law to be legal because they do not have the required markings for postban mags.
As far as the 12-round .45 mags for the full-size USPs, they are available from reputable dealers in the US and do not have postban markings. Contrary to the bull you read on the boards and even from HK USA, these mags are presumed by law to be legal because they do not have the required markings for postban mags.
Like the man said, the Expert comes with the extended magazine well -- termed "jet funnel" by HK --in the 9mm and .40 caliber versions. If added to the .45 frame, the gun is not legal in IPSC standard class.
As far as the 12-round .45 mags for the full-size USPs, they are available from reputable dealers in the US and do not have postban markings. Contrary to the bull you read on the boards and even from HK USA, these mags are presumed by law to be legal because they do not have the required markings for postban mags.
As far as the 12-round .45 mags for the full-size USPs, they are available from reputable dealers in the US and do not have postban markings. Contrary to the bull you read on the boards and even from HK USA, these mags are presumed by law to be legal because they do not have the required markings for postban mags.
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FWIW,
I would be very careful when it comes to high cap USP .45 and SOCOM mags as HK has filed with ATF as having never produced high capacity civillian ammunition feeding devices (magazines) for US distribution/sale and publicly stated this same fact several times.
The magazines for sale in the US are in fact illegal imports that can be subject to sizure by the US Customs service.
I believe we are all aware that these magazines are circulating but you cannot legally enter the country with one as a declared item.
_________________
Think, Plan, Train, Be Safe.
Thanks,
David
<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: David DiFabio on 2001-07-07 07:44 ]</font>
I would be very careful when it comes to high cap USP .45 and SOCOM mags as HK has filed with ATF as having never produced high capacity civillian ammunition feeding devices (magazines) for US distribution/sale and publicly stated this same fact several times.
The magazines for sale in the US are in fact illegal imports that can be subject to sizure by the US Customs service.
I believe we are all aware that these magazines are circulating but you cannot legally enter the country with one as a declared item.
_________________
Think, Plan, Train, Be Safe.
Thanks,
David
<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: David DiFabio on 2001-07-07 07:44 ]</font>
The mags are *already* in the country. They are being sold by reputable FFL license holders who are not gong to jeopardize their licenses to sell a few contraband mags.
There have been no warnings published by the BATF regarding these mags as being stolen or illegal or no prosecutions. Indeed, without proper post-ban markings, the law assumes that these are legal pre-ban mags. It's up to the government to prove otherwise.
The stupidity here is in paying exorbitant prices for an extra two-round capacity. *That's* why you shouldn't buy these mags.
There have been no warnings published by the BATF regarding these mags as being stolen or illegal or no prosecutions. Indeed, without proper post-ban markings, the law assumes that these are legal pre-ban mags. It's up to the government to prove otherwise.
The stupidity here is in paying exorbitant prices for an extra two-round capacity. *That's* why you shouldn't buy these mags.
Spend some time changing mags quickly. You shouldn't run the mag dry in the first place. Put a fresh one in and you have 10 more not 2 more. Whether it holds 10 or 12 or 30 is mostly like how much horsepower your car has. The question is...can you drive it?
That extra 2 in the mag doesn't mean a thing, especially when they cost so much.
That extra 2 in the mag doesn't mean a thing, especially when they cost so much.
David,
I tried a HK 45 Expert this weekend for the first time, and found the SA trigger to be much better than I expected, based on what I heard about "HK triggers" - I guess there must be a pretty big improvement from triggers from the USP to the Match.
You mentioned in an earlier post, "For most users purchasing the match trigger pack for $100.00 and having a smith install it is a much better way to go." I don't understand this, can you help me understand? Does this refer to the Wolff reduced power 10lb hammer spring you also mentioned?
You also mentioned, "For normal USP users who like the case system it is available for $55.00 average from BlackHawk or HK". Again I don't understand to what you refer.
In trying to pick between the Tactical and the Expert, I notice that the weight difference is not all that much, but the sight radius is 6.34 vs. 7.5 inch, which seems significant. Have you found this to make that much of a difference in practical shooting? (Kind of strange that the Match shares the *shorter* sight radius).
Thanks,
Mark
I tried a HK 45 Expert this weekend for the first time, and found the SA trigger to be much better than I expected, based on what I heard about "HK triggers" - I guess there must be a pretty big improvement from triggers from the USP to the Match.
You mentioned in an earlier post, "For most users purchasing the match trigger pack for $100.00 and having a smith install it is a much better way to go." I don't understand this, can you help me understand? Does this refer to the Wolff reduced power 10lb hammer spring you also mentioned?
You also mentioned, "For normal USP users who like the case system it is available for $55.00 average from BlackHawk or HK". Again I don't understand to what you refer.
In trying to pick between the Tactical and the Expert, I notice that the weight difference is not all that much, but the sight radius is 6.34 vs. 7.5 inch, which seems significant. Have you found this to make that much of a difference in practical shooting? (Kind of strange that the Match shares the *shorter* sight radius).
Thanks,
Mark
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The HK match trigger pack is available for purchase as one complete unit and can be dropped into a plain USP by an armorer/smith for about $100.00.
Doing so allows the improved trigger to be used at a much lower price than the match gun.
A lot of guys comment on the "cool" HK Match pistol case, Blackhawk is the manufacturer of the match and Socom cases.
I find the sight radius difference to be neither hide nor hare.
Doing so allows the improved trigger to be used at a much lower price than the match gun.
A lot of guys comment on the "cool" HK Match pistol case, Blackhawk is the manufacturer of the match and Socom cases.
I find the sight radius difference to be neither hide nor hare.
I have the Tactical, and having shot the Expert on a few occasions, I'd recommend the former over the latter.
Even if you never plan on adding a silencer, Capital City Firearms markets a flash suppressor for the Tactical that not only significantly reduces flash signature, it also noticeably tightens groups and improves follow-up shots by dampening felt recoil. At a cost of about $100, this product really improves overall performance.
I added a SureFire Tac light, which diminishes recoil even further, to complete the package. Blackhawk makes a holster specifically designed for the rig.
I think the total cost for everything was around $1250.
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